Are We a Nation of Pussies?
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What’s wrong with youth today?? No matter where you stand on the issue of Iraq - and I’m not saying where I stand on it, as it’s not germane to the issue at hand - you have to admit that there are a lot of people who are strongly opposed to our involvement with the war in Iraq.
In particular, there are a lot of young adults - or even not so young adults - adults between the ages of say 18 and 30, who are very opposed to the Iraq war.
So where the hell are they all?
Why, in my time we knew how to make our voices heard. And we did it. Because we cared.
Remember the Vietnam war? Remember the protests?? The protest songs?? Demonstrations? Kent State? People setting themselves on fire?
Now, I’m not suggesting that the young adults of this generation should set themselves on fire, or get themselves shot at, but where the hell are the protests and the protest songs? Where are the demonstrations?
Somehow, complaining about our involvement in Iraq over a triple mochacino with a twist, and disclaiming responsibility with a shrug of the shoulders and a “Well, I didn’t vote for him”, is hardly enough. Is it?
Oh sure, you can see a few passive “demonstrators” on street corners, holding up signs protesting the Iraq war - but have you ever noticed who they are? Without exception they are the same people who demonstrated against the Vietnam war, and they are out there now, doing it again. Grandmothers and grandfathers in their 50s and 60s, showing up today’s generation, and showing them how it’s done.
And what about the protest songs? Where are the Bobs and Jonis and Arlos of today - where are they??
Where is the zeal? The outrage? The passion? The involvement??
Where, oh WHERE, are the young adults who should be out waiving protest signs with enthusiasm, singing protest songs with energy, and yelling at passers by, and yes, even the law?
Have we raised a nation of pussies?
C’mon, join in and sing it with me…
Where have all the protests gone…
Long time passing…
Where have all the protests gone…
Long time ago…
Where have all the protests gone?
They’ve gone down in apathy, every one…
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?
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January 16th, 2006 at 12:09 pm
“She says my ass hurts when I sit down,
she says my feet hurt when I am standing around
I think my body is as restless as my mind
and I don’t think I can roll with it this time.
She packed his uniforms and drove him to the base
she was crying all the way the world looked her in the face
and said ‘roll with it baby, make it your career, keep those
home fires burning, till America is in the clear’.
The main stream is so polluted with lies,
once you are wet its so hard to get dry
we are all taught, how to justify
history as it passes by
and yes, it’s your world that comes crashing down
when the big boys want to throw their weight around,
but just roll with it baby, make it your career,
keep those home fires burning, till America in in the clear.
What if the enemy isn’t in a distant land,
what if the enemy lies behind the voice of command
the sound of war is a childs cry
behind tinted windows, they just drive by,
and all I know is that those, that are going to be killed
aren’t those that preside on Capitol Hill
I told him, ‘don’t fill the front lines of their wars,
Those assholes aren’t worth dying for’
and he said ‘roll with it baby, make it your career
keep those home fires burning, ’till America is in the clear’
But she says ‘my ass hurts when I sit down’, she says,’my feet hurt
from standing around, I think my body is as restless as mind, and
I don’t think I can roll with it this time,
no I’m not going to roll with it this time”.
–Ani Difranco
January 16th, 2006 at 12:13 pm
yes,
us people are just poems
we’re 90% metaphor
with a leanness of meaning
approaching hyper-distillation
and once upon a time
we were moonshine
rushing down the throat of a giraffe
yes, rushing down the long hallway
despite what the p.a. announcement says
yes, rushing down the long stairs
with the whiskey of eternity
fermented and distilled
to eighteen minutes
burning down our throats
down the hall
down the stairs
in a building so tall
that it will always be there
yes, it’s part of a pair
there on the bow of noah’s ark
the most prestigious couple
just kickin back parked
against a perfectly blue sky
on a morning beatific
in its indian summer breeze
on the day that america
fell to its knees
after strutting around for a century
without saying thank you
or please
and the shock was subsonic
and the smoke was deafening
between the setup and the punch line
cuz we were all on time for work that day
we all boarded that plane for to fly
and then while the fires were raging
we all climbed up on the windowsill
and then we all held hands
and jumped into the sky
and every borough looked up when it heard the first blast
and then every dumb action movie was summarily surpassed
and the exodus uptown by foot and motorcar
looked more like war than anything i’ve seen so far
so far
so far
so fierce and ingenious
a poetic specter so far gone
that every jackass newscaster was struck dumb and stumbling
over ‘oh my god’ and ‘this is unbelievable’ and on and on
and i’ll tell you what, while we’re at it
you can keep the pentagon
keep the propaganda
keep each and every tv
that’s been trying to convince me
to participate
in some prep school punk’s plan to perpetuate retribution
perpetuate retribution
even as the blue toxic smoke of our lesson in retribution
is still hanging in the air
and there’s ash on our shoes
and there’s ash in our hair
and there’s a fine silt on every mantle
from hell’s kitchen to brooklyn
and the streets are full of stories
sudden twists and near misses
and soon every open bar is crammed to the rafters
with tales of narrowly averted disasters
and the whiskey is flowin
like never before
as all over the country
folks just shake their heads
and pour
so here’s a toast to all the folks who live in palestine
afghanistan
iraq
el salvador
here’s a toast to the folks living on the pine ridge reservation
under the stone cold gaze of mt. rushmore
here’s a toast to all those nurses and doctors
who daily provide women with a choice
who stand down a threat the size of oklahoma city
just to listen to a young woman’s voice
here’s a toast to all the folks on death row right now
awaiting the executioner’s guillotine
who are shackled there with dread and can only escape into their heads
to find peace in the form of a dream
cuz take away our playstations
and we are a third world nation
under the thumb of some blue blood royal son
who stole the oval office and that phony election
i mean
it don’t take a weatherman
to look around and see the weather
jeb said he’d deliver florida, folks
and boy did he ever
and we hold these truths to be self evident:
#1 george w. bush is not president
#2 america is not a true democracy
#3 the media is not fooling me
cuz i am a poem heeding hyper-distillation
i’ve got no room for a lie so verbose
i’m looking out over my whole human family
and i’m raising my glass in a toast
here’s to our last drink of fossil fuels
let us vow to get off of this sauce
shoo away the swarms of commuter planes
and find that train ticket we lost
cuz once upon a time the line followed the river
and peeked into all the backyards
and the laundry was waving
the graffiti was teasing us
from brick walls and bridges
we were rolling over ridges
through valleys
under stars
i dream of touring like duke ellington
in my own railroad car
i dream of waiting on the tall blonde wooden benches
in a grand station aglow with grace
and then standing out on the platform
and feeling the air on my face
give back the night its distant whistle
give the darkness back its soul
give the big oil companies the finger finally
and relearn how to rock-n-roll
yes, the lessons are all around us and a change is waiting there
so it’s time to pick through the rubble, clean the streets
and clear the air
get our government to pull its big dick out of the sand
of someone else’s desert
put it back in its pants
and quit the hypocritical chants of
freedom forever
cuz when one lone phone rang
in two thousand and one
at ten after nine
on nine one one
which is the number we all called
when that lone phone rang right off the wall
right off our desk and down the long hall
down the long stairs
in a building so tall
that the whole world turned
just to watch it fall
and while we’re at it
remember the first time around?
the bomb?
the ryder truck?
the parking garage?
the princess that didn’t even feel the pea?
remember joking around in our apartment on avenue D?
can you imagine how many paper coffee cups would have to change their design
following a fantastical reversal of the new york skyline?!
it was a joke, of course
it was a joke
at the time
and that was just a few years ago
so let the record show
that the FBI was all over that case
that the plot was obvious and in everybody’s face
and scoping that scene
religiously
the CIA
or is it KGB?
committing countless crimes against humanity
with this kind of eventuality
as its excuse
for abuse after expensive abuse
and it didn’t have a clue
look, another window to see through
way up here
on the 104th floor
look
another key
another door
10% literal
90% metaphor
3000 some poems disguised as people
on an almost too perfect day
should be more than pawns
in some asshole’s passion play
so now it’s your job
and it’s my job
to make it that way
to make sure they didn’t die in vain
sshhhhhh….
baby listen
hear the train?
—Ani Difranco
January 16th, 2006 at 12:58 pm
Just thought I would post a few of my fav. modern war songs. Speaking for myself - and perhaps other members of this “young nation of pussies” - assuming that they will let me put in a word for them - I can’t say that it is because I was raised a “pussy”, as I was not. I suppose that for me it is several things that keep me from singing angry songs, protesting on street corners, burning my bra (whoops, wrong protest) and marching the steps of Capitol Hill in fierce protest.
1. I have my own cause that is more important to me – does that make me selfish to my own agenda? – yes – but who isn’t? On the other side of that, while I may be engrossed in my own political bandwagons, I am not completely (only partially) blind to what other events are going on in the news, and as a normal, judgmental, reactive, person, I will watch the top news story that brings us the latest from the land of bombs and sand and dissect it this way: 1 – take out the obvious slanted view from the show’s producers, 2- take away the “appeal to emotion� fallacies committed with every picture of screaming mothers and bloodied children flashed up on the screen, and, 3 – look at what little else I have left. From that I take into account that there is probably only one side being shown, so as not to make myself feel like a total ignoramus, I will judge what I see, but only while reminding myself that I am only judging based on what is in front of me, and keeping myself open to the fact that there may be more to the story. All that being said and done, yes, I will judge. I will say, “That asshole needs to pull out and stop getting our troops blown up by the masses.� I am perfectly in my right to say this. And I will say it. And then I will turn back to dealing with my own agenda.
2. Do you know what those old people demonstrating on the corner get? Smiles, waves, and car honks. Does anyone care beyond that? No.
3. If I could leave my job, grow my hair really long, travel by VW bus to D.C. with my friends “Sunbeam�, and “Moonflower�, smoking weed and singing protest songs – I would be the first to do it. Not saying that this is what all the Vietnam protesting was about, but I’ve seen pictures. If it was more than that, then perhaps our former generations should have been a little more forthcoming with the truth, rather than leaving us to judge the images.
4. Technology has changed – and I am not saying that this is a good thing when it comes to the good ole protest. We are a nation of hermits. We sit in our houses, or our offices, and crack-out on our PC’s, PDA’s, cell phones, Macs, or whatever your pleasure is. We don’t have to form protests! They’re just a click away!
5. What difference will it make? Let’s be realistic. It is quite evident that our current government officials are a big incestuous, orgy, of bigwigs that have come under a huge amount of fire for what is going on right now. Has that made a difference? No. Maybe this is their intention, but I look at Bush and everyone else standing by their decisions, and it is almost as if they are this huge impenetrable wall. What exactly will protest do? Bush doesn’t care. He is after his own agenda – are we supposed to put time and effort, and resources, towards something that won’t make a difference. I will be the first one to say, “vote, because every vote counts�, but even I am floored in this situation. I look at the people on TV who have been trying hard and they are getting nowhere. It has been going on, for what seems like forever, with no crack in the wall.
This remainder of this presidency is like bad sex, just close your eyes and hope that it is over with soon.
January 16th, 2006 at 5:04 pm
Speaking from the other side of the pond, here’s how I see it. Bush declares war on Iraq, well actually no,is that how you remember it? and this really pisses me off, there is no war on iraq, we were on Iraq’s side, the war was against the dictator, to free the nation from oppression and torture. Which is good.
There may be some subtext about Oil, but lets not mention that, come to think of it lets not mention the Weapons of Mass destruction either, best hidden under the carpet, with the other things that never happened. I remember very clearly Blair speaking to us saying he had information which he could not give us now, but we had to trust him and he’d show us later. I thought what a load of Bollocks at the time, and sadly was proved correct.
Every person I know in Britain opposed the use of WAR, but our dictator, sorry elected representative, knew best and did what the hell he wanted anyway. Or may be he just jumped to come and play with the big kid in the play ground. What am I doing about it? Well I have voted twice, for the first time in my life, but as Jess mentions above, I made no difference. Don’t let them get away with this, don’t forget, it doesn’t matter what they do now, they should forfeit there right to rule based on this one event. Teach your children how to vote, so it doesn’t take them 33 years to get around to figuring it out for themselves, look to the future first, not the past, because our children will inherit what we leave and have there chance to shape it.
January 16th, 2006 at 8:28 pm
I have to think that many of the street corner protests have moved into cyberspace. Sure, you see the 60s generation standing on the street corners with signs occasionally, but the younger protesters are standing on website soapboxes. Look at Wil Wheaton (www.wilwheaton.net), for example. His readership is in the hundreds of thousands, and though he doesn’t always wax political, he doesn’t keep his political opinions secret, either.
As for music, another band that’s not afraid to express its anti-war opinion is Green Day. American Idiot is infused with political overtones, and is one of the most successful albums of the last several years. And, as Jess points out, Ani has always been outspoken about her political beliefs.
I am not overly outspoken about my political, social, or religious beliefs. If I were, my blood pressure would be even higher than it already is. However, I do occasionally get fed up, and the following URL is a good example of what happens when I do: http://www.lytspeed.com/cj.asp?PassID=158
Just because the streetcorner has turned into an exit on the Infobahn, that doesn’t mean the protesters aren’t there. We just carry domain names and electric guitars instead of signs and tambourines.
January 17th, 2006 at 1:32 pm
Why no (significant) protestors? One word: DRAFT. As in “no draft”.
If a draft was instituted today, I suspect the pampered youth of today would show you that they are not “pussies” when it is their butt on the line. Does that still make them pussies? I’m sure intelligent folks could argue both sides of that question.
I’m not old enough to recall Viet Nam parallels (and I’m not suggesting that you are either Anne :-). Were there any significant protests before the draft was instituted or activated in the 60s?
January 19th, 2006 at 10:30 am
People your generation were retarded. Thats why they set themselves on fire. We talk about it in a civilized manner. People like you are a disgrace to this country.
January 19th, 2006 at 2:50 pm
“I never thought about the universe, it made me feel small
Never thought about the problems of this planet at all
Global warming, radio-active sites
Imperialistic wrongs and animal rights! No!
Why think of all the bad things when life is so good?
Why help with an ‘am’ when there’s always a ‘could’?
Let the whales worry about the poisons in the sea
Outside of California, it’s foreign policy
I don’t want changes, I have no reactions
Your dilemmas are my distractions
That’s no way to go, Franco Un-American
No way to go, Franco Un-American
No way to go, Franco Un-American
No way to go, Franco, Franco Un-American
I never looked around, never second-guessed
Then I read some Howard Zinn now I’m always depressed
And now I can’t sleep from years of apathy
All because I read a little Noam Chomsky
I’m eating vegetation, ’cause of fast food nation
I’m wearing a couple of shoes ’cause of globalization
I’m watching Michael Moore expose the awful truth
I’m listening to Public Enemy and Reagan Youth
I see no world peace ’cause of zealous armed forces
I eat no breath-mints ’cause their from de-hoofed horses
Now I can’t believe; what an absolute failure
The president’s laughing ’cause we voted for Nader
That’s no way to go, Franco Un-American
No way to go, Franco Un-American
No way to go, Franco Un-American
Where can we go, Franco Un-American
I want to move north and be a Canadian
Or hang down low with the nice Australians
I don’t want to be another ‘I-don’t-care-ican’
What are we gonna do Franco, Franco Un-American”
- NOFX, “Franco Un-American”
January 19th, 2006 at 2:56 pm
I’d protest, but I have to go to work.
January 20th, 2006 at 5:09 am
I agree with Lindsay… I have to work. That’s something that the first batch of hippies/boomers didn’t get. Then, when they were old enough, they became the greedy pigs that are ruining us now. Face it (old) hippies, you were in it for yourselves. Always have been.
January 20th, 2006 at 3:43 pm
The number one reason in my mind…the Police States of America. This administration, and as a tricle-down, all those in authority, think they can do what they want no matter what the law says. The ultra right has a grip and “you better not get out of line, son, or we’ll lock you up and throw away the key.” Gone is civility. Gone is respect for others’ rights. Gone is compromise and temperence. Gone are our civil rights. “You’re either with us or against us. If you’re against us, we’ll make your life hell.”
The draft is a biggie as well. If my fellow idiot citizens want to go fight and die for whatever reason, that’s their battle and their loss.
January 21st, 2006 at 5:24 am
*I have to work. That’s something that the first batch of hippies/boomers didn’t get. Then, when they were old enough, they became the greedy pigs that are ruining us now. Face it (old) hippies, you were in it for yourselves. Always have been.”
Sorry - wrong. As an original Haight Ashbury hippy, I worked. A LOT of us worked. We had our own businesses, our own support systems, our own medical clinics, newspapers, our own infrastructure. Granted, we didn’t always work for financial remuneration. Barter was the standard in those days. And still is for a lot of us. We weren’t in it for ourselves. We did care. Many of us still do. Not all the hippies mutated into greedy yuppies. Some of us are still, well, hippies.
January 26th, 2006 at 6:59 am
I’m a late arriver so my post is a few days late but here goes anyway. As an “old hippy” I can promise I’ve never been in it for myself. I’ve spent my live working to maintain viable gene pools of endangered species, and that is exactly what zookeeping is about these days. I promise you it pays just enough to keep a roof over my head, barely. I have voted in every election in the last forty years, even when I had to hold my nose to do so. I’ve fought running street battles, written letters, gone door to door with petitions, vented in cyberspace, given money and, damn it, stood on street corners even when I knew nobody cared. Why? Because I care even if the people honking at me don’t. There is action and then there is complacency. I’ll take the action side, thank you.
January 26th, 2006 at 6:28 pm
To you old protesters:remember the “Bring the Boys Home” signs you carried ? How many of you greeted
us with open arms when we did return? None that I remember unless you were a family member.Most of
you were too busy calling us baby killers and spitting on us.No welcome home parades or parties But
then, we really didn’t expect any.At least now everyone supports the troops.
January 26th, 2006 at 6:33 pm
I meant to add that the “pussies” you mention are in Iraq and Afgan-defending our country.Thats more
than you ever did with your protests.
January 26th, 2006 at 7:36 pm
It is of some interest that a couple of years ago a reporter went looking for photographic proof of returning servicemen being spit upon. It seems almost every Viet Nam vet claims he was spit on. Considering the endless footage shot of returning servicemen and of the protests you would think that somewhere there would be hundreds, nay, thousands of pictures of these poor persecuted souls literally dripping in spit. Amazingly there is not one singel photograph or news reel that shows that happening anywhere. I protested the war and never once called anybody a name and certainly never spit upon anything other than my hands. And nobody, nobody is calling the service men and women in Iraq and Afghanastan pussies. The original post was stating the obvious; if you disagree with something, get up off your lazy butt and do something to change it. That’s hardly a radical thought.
January 26th, 2006 at 7:43 pm
Actually, I didn’t protest Vietnam. And, in fact, I was a 64c, thank you very much, and while I didn’t go to ‘nam, I did my time in Germany.
People *in* the service are hardly pussies. And people who really disagree with the policies and who *are* protesting (but where the hell are they?) aren’t pussies.
It’s the disaffected youth who complain and moan like they know what they are talking about, because it’s, you know, cool and in vogue to bash the administration, but they don’t actually *do* anything about their discontent. They just bitch and moan and sip their double mocha pinkacinos.
They don’t enlist, they don’t protest.
They just whine.
January 27th, 2006 at 6:18 am
After the first units were deployed to Vietnam:replacements were sent to Nam as individuals instead
of being sent over with your company.You went to Nam alone and returned alone.There were no cameras,
no news people and no interest,when we returned.So I find it hard to believe that there are hundreds
of pictures and file footage.As we use to say “It don’t mean nothing”.The war is over and we moved on.
I feel the use of the word “pussie” was in poor taste and I have a right to my opinion.
January 29th, 2006 at 12:47 pm
Why would I go out and protest? I support the war.
However, if I didnt support it, I will still find better, more proactive ways to change national policy (which first begins with changing people’s minds, since America overwhelmingly voted for people who voted for the war, and then voted to reelect the architect of the war). Look at the morons who have posted above about living in a “barter system” and participating in “running street battles.” They never inspired anyone or changed anyone’s minds, they were just using the war in Vietnam as an outlet for their frustration with their own impotence.
Changing minds takes a lot more than shouting at TV cameras and bothering police and military recruiters - those are just activities you do for your own satisfaction. They were all about themselves - to the point that they would not then and could never know realize (much less admit) it. In fact, it was the media, who launched an expansive, directed, and effective campaign to change the minds of Americans, that enacted change more than anyone else.
The author of this rant comes off sounding like an angsty college student, not someone who lives and works in the real world - even though I can see you have served, which I respect… but do you use the “barter system” or something? “Passion” and “zeal” do not make you right, and they don’t make anyone listen to you. You win with reason, by encouraging hope, and by changing minds. Did someone screaming on a street corner ever change your mind?
January 30th, 2006 at 2:50 pm
As one of the “morons” mentioned in your reply, I’ve read and re-read your post searching for “reason”, hope and an attempt to change minds. Maybe it’s just me, but all three seemed to be missing. What I saw was childish name calling, belittling other people’s lifestyles, and dismissing such fine attributes as passion as zeal.
My running street battles were fought 38 years ago. Since those days I written letters, had running dialogs with a large number of people holding different views than mine, honed my skills at logic and “passionately” argued for a host of positions spanning the policical spectrum.
For what it’s worth, your diatribe certainly didn’t change my mind about anything. But it did remind me of what low esteem I hold those who resort to name calling.
January 30th, 2006 at 3:33 pm
And yes, I do wish She Devil had refrained from using the word Pussies. But it certainly got a response.
January 30th, 2006 at 8:20 pm
Are there really people as stupid as ‘timo’ out there? Wow.
January 31st, 2006 at 8:40 am
Why demonstrate when contacting Congressional leaders are your only real
chance to impact the situation? After all, no matter what you may believe,
it is the representatives, not the people, who ultimately make the decisions
and should hear the arguments for/against. The hippies were just trying to
get their 15 minutes of fame, it had little to do with actual change. Only
grass-root lobbying has the ability to create change.
February 1st, 2006 at 8:55 am
My DW objects to the word “pussy” as well. She thinks it’s chauvanistic. Are you a chauvinist, SD?
Meanwhile, the answer is yes, we have raised a nation of pussies. We took corporal punishment (and every other kind of discipline) out of the schools. Then we took parental responsibility away from parents and placed it with the schools. And thus we have raised kids with no discipline, no sense of “self” and no understanding of basic individualism. In short, we have a nation of pussified, socialist kids. The only thing that may save us now is the jolt of reality they’ll get when they go out in the Real World.
Who is John Galt?
February 2nd, 2006 at 9:26 pm
omg u called me a pussie im gonna argue wit u over teh internet!!!!!!!!!1
September 19th, 2006 at 12:08 pm
I don’t know if I would go so far as to call us a “bunch of pussies” - after all, we’re not French.
I think America’s problem is the “sitcom” mentality - everything will be fine in 22.5 minutes (minus commercials). We’ve got a nation
of people with A.D.D.
I believe you need to exercise your right to speak freely, or you will (unknowingly) surrender it.
September 20th, 2006 at 7:35 pm
I do believe the American youth are afraid of being arrested. If you do not agree with
the administration you are a communist. You could get shot or worse, get sent abroad
to be detained and possibly tortured to find out if you did or did not watch the tonight
show. In my time not only was it part of the movement to disagree but it was almost
required. Some jail sentences were the local Saigon Jail. Today it is just sit back
and it will be over soon. This is bad.
December 13th, 2006 at 10:40 pm
Hello
After reading every single one of these comments I understand so much more about my country and why we are in the situation we’re in. I am ashamed and so should you be. Don’t you realize how serious the problems with this country truly are. We are dying! Our freedoms, our rights are dying. We are angry but we bicker at each other. We know why we are angry and who we’re angry at, but we are so powerless we snarl at each other. I support our troops, fact is my daughter is a troop in Iraq, but I nor does she support this war. She signed up because of a bunch of lies, and now she must take lives or give her own for something she don’t even believe in. She isn’t fighting for this country. How could she be, our country was in no fight. Our government was up to there noses in scandal and it followed them home, and what it’s our fault?
Our government has issues, big issues. They are going to continue to strip our rights, continue the corruption, and keep endangering our families if we don’t come together and CREATE a way to take back control of our out of control leadership.
We can’t continue to turn our heads when our leaders bold face lie, corrupt, and demoralize our country. I myself don’t care how people stand up as long as they do. I myself really don’t like to hear “I would but I have to work� because that shows they would, but they don’t really want to lose their jobs over something that will make no difference. HOW COME WE CANT MAKE A DIFFERENCE? I mean isn’t this our country? Isn’t the government our employees? Why is public positions so secret? Why can’t we have cameras in these offices so we can see and hear these employees do what we hired them to do? How come we don’t expect them to listen when we tell them what we want? How come our troops can’t come home since the government lied?
How come we are not in control and why are we letting them to strip us of our voice and individual freedoms and rights???
I would like to hear these same people rant to my “Cattle By Number� rant. I’d like to hear what you have to say.
Oh and Ralph, study the 2000 presidential election, it isn’t always cut and dry as it should be.